Every time I see the torture apologists on the Great Furniture of Learning endlessly babble on in repetitive theoretical language used by, to be fair, either side, I always wonder why the argument isn’t just ended, you know, with a simple request to the “pro-torture” sadists/bedwetters.

“Look, we don’t need to argue about this: Undergo some water-boarding, and if you aren’t made to say something we know to be not only antipathy to absolutely everything you publicly claim to believe like, ‘water-boarding isn’t torture,’ but a blatant factual lie, like, say, ‘The sun rises in the west’ for example, then if you hold out, [I’ll] concede water-boarding isn’t torture. Or you fold, and concede that it is. To make it more fun, we can try to make you say that last bit while you’re being water-boarded, so we’ll have fodder for filling TV time later: Did you say it was torture because you were being water-boarded, or because you (now) believe it is?”

(Hint: This is how Overton Windows are moved.)

Call it the OlbermannVentura gambit.

Christ, it’s sickening to watch. Not only that, it has become so boring to me I just turn the channel. Take that, advertisers!

Cut to the fucking chase, talk about something else, or shut your pie-holes.

…as torture since there is such a simple solution to it: Waterboard anyone who claims it isn’t torture, until they say it is or never break. We could even have Dr.’s around for them, and tell them they only had to go through it 183 times, so they felt all safe and secure about it, a luxury I don’t think our prisoners have. If they make it through 183 and never break, their principled stand is good by me.

It would make the case pretty rock solid on either side of the fence. They either don’t break, agree that it was torture, or come out later and say they lied about it to make it stop.

Simple, clean, and decisive! We could even tally up the results!

It makes too much sense to actually happen, of course. I’m torn on the whole prosecution thing. I’m wildly morally supportive of it, because people should be held accountable for breaking the law, but the country is in such a mess I’m afraid it will kill us economically and politically.

Another fine Bush legacy, and another demonstration of Bush’s special skill at putting us in lose-lose situations. Bizarro-genius.

Update: Step up, Sean Hannity! Can I do the questioning? I’ll do it for free.

Update 2: Right on! Keith Olbermann issues the same challenge to Hannity! And puts some money where his mouth is! It’s early in the show, but it will be fun to see how this plays out.

Update 3: MSNBC makes it difficult (OK, I found it impossible) to e-mail Keith the suggested ground rules, which is too bad. It would make for better TV.

Anyone who doesn’t think this idea is a deficit-busting (just kidding, but seriously highly profitable) pay-per-view event, done under my direction, is crazy.

I watched Matthews tonight, I’m watching Olbermann as I type, and I haven’t seen word ONE about Stewart’s interview with Cramer last night, even though it DID make the front pages of several prominent “news” outlets. Christ, my Mom heard about it on the radio. WGN talk radio in Chicago.

Disappointing, for sure, but entirely consistent with my world view.

No question at all the gag order is in effect.

Fight it, or slave for it. That’s pretty much what we’re down to.

Update: E-mail to NBC.com:

I found it awfully amusing, if terrifying, that the gag order was clearly in effect when it came to even your liberal shows not uttering a word about the Stewart-Cramer interview last night.

It’s a new world, and you should adapt to it. A desperate clinging to power is very unappealing. Think, “Mugabe.”

I watch Matthews almost religiously, I watch Olbermann from time to time especially lately, and I love the Maddow show because she’s just so damn smart and polite.

No WAY do they not talk about the Interview without orders not to do so.

With all due respect, fuck you. You’re missing a big money-maker, and that is the absolute rage felt by people on all sides of the political spectrum about reverse welfare. A corporation that can’t capitalize on widespread public rage deserves no investment.


John O

Update 2: Holy shit! Here’s a prediction I would bet the wife and kids on, if I had any: Shep Smith is not long for FOX “News.” This is VERY funny stuff. HUGE hat tip to John Cole for this work of art.

Update 3: Kudos to NBC. They’re floating a trial balloon with Maddow, to see if what she has to say sells, because she’s the first NBC employee to mention The Interview on TV air that I know of. I retract, if only a little since they’re still controlling who says what, my e-mail to NBC. Thank God they’re still curious about capitalism!

Update 4: Kudos are also in big order for Shepperd Smith at FOX. He MAY actually have a brain and conscience.

Update 5: Fuck you, NBC. You were OK with Rachel referring to it, but not talking about it. What a bunch of rich prick asshole anti-free speech losers you are.

Just watch it.

Thanks, Keith.

Update: I checked the link, and it seems OK. Sorry. Just look for 8 years in 8 minutes.

Just because Maddow and Olbermann so far are calling it as I see it, only for a million people instead of three.